From joy.vriens at nerim.net Sun Jul 2 23:40:05 2006 From: joy.vriens at nerim.net (Joy Vriens) Date: Sun Jul 2 23:40:17 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Black nails In-Reply-To: <7610176240.20060630113813@kungzhi.org> References: <7610176240.20060630113813@kungzhi.org> Message-ID: <44A8ADB5.80909@nerim.net> Dear friends, In his History of Zen Suzuki tells a story from "Indian Buddhism" about a Brahman called "Black nails" in chapter IV (I only have the French translation of the book). I found the story on the Internet and there it goes like this: "When Buddha was alive, there was a Brahman whose name was Black-nails, who came to the Buddha and offered him two huge flowering trees which he carried each in one of his hands. The Buddha told the Brahman, Black-nail, ?Put them down!? The Brahman put the flowering tree down in his left hand before the Buddha. Buddha called out to him again, ?Put them down!? Then Black-nails put the other flowering tree in his right hand. But, Buddha still kept demanding, ?Put them down!? At this time the Brahman said: ?I have nothing in my hands. What do you want me to put down? ? The Buddha said: ?I never told you to abandon your flowering trees. What I want you to do is abandon your six objects of sense (eyes, ears, nose, tongue, body, and mind), six organs of sense (form, sound, smell, taste, touch, dharma-which means those objects that arise in the heart), and your six consciousnesses (sense awareness through the eyes, ears, nose, tongue, body, mind). When these are abandoned all at once, it is then that you are released from the bondage of birth-and-death? Does anyone know the Indian source of this story (Suzuki didn't give it)? And ... two huge flowering trees?... Joy From jmp at peavler.org Wed Jul 5 11:31:32 2006 From: jmp at peavler.org (Jim Peavler) Date: Wed Jul 5 11:32:04 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Where are the joys of yesteryear? In-Reply-To: References: <200606231800.k5NI0jXr030282@ns1.swcp.com> <119576618.20060626003646@gmail.com> <114136387.20060626013230@kungzhi.org> <454069759.20060626034951@gmail.com> <51617609.20060626083930@kungzhi.org> <906931531.20060626175803@gmail.com> <1935716247.20060626184834@kungzhi.org> <12383043.20060626225623@kungzhi.org> Message-ID: <9248EC3C-8680-42A9-AABA-593A12153056@peavler.org> This thread must be really good Buddhism. It has certainly become joyless. You folks are a dour as Prebysterians! From curt at cola.iges.org Wed Jul 5 12:11:05 2006 From: curt at cola.iges.org (curt) Date: Wed Jul 5 12:11:31 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Where are the joys of yesteryear? In-Reply-To: <9248EC3C-8680-42A9-AABA-593A12153056@peavler.org> References: <200606231800.k5NI0jXr030282@ns1.swcp.com> <119576618.20060626003646@gmail.com> <114136387.20060626013230@kungzhi.org> <454069759.20060626034951@gmail.com> <51617609.20060626083930@kungzhi.org> <906931531.20060626175803@gmail.com> <1935716247.20060626184834@kungzhi.org> <12383043.20060626225623@kungzhi.org> <9248EC3C-8680-42A9-AABA-593A12153056@peavler.org> Message-ID: <44AC00B9.4020708@cola.iges.org> And at least Presbyterians have the excuse that they follow a religion that was started by people who consider a sheep's stomach to be a delicacy, and the wailing of a bagpipe to be music. Here is a link to a recipe for vegetarian haggis: http://www.macsween.co.uk/veg_haggis.htm And here's a link to where one can purchase canned vegan haggis: http://store.foodfightgrocery.com/veganhaggis.html - Curt Jim Peavler wrote: > This thread must be really good Buddhism. It has certainly become > joyless. > > You folks are a dour as Prebysterians! > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > > From bcarral at kungzhi.org Sat Jul 15 15:28:21 2006 From: bcarral at kungzhi.org (Benito Carral) Date: Sat Jul 15 15:28:47 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Allan Wallace's e-mail Message-ID: <1813117767.20060715232821@kungzhi.org> Dear Buddha-L friends, Does someone know Allan Wallace's e-mail? Thank you and best wishes, -- Benito Carral Asturias, Sepharad (Spain) From jamesward at earthlink.net Thu Jul 20 22:27:32 2006 From: jamesward at earthlink.net (James Ward) Date: Thu Jul 20 22:27:42 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking Message-ID: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Hi all, Please ignore this message -- I'm just making sure I can still send and receive messages from Buddha-L. Best wishes, James Ward From jmp at peavler.org Fri Jul 21 11:11:03 2006 From: jmp at peavler.org (Jim Peavler) Date: Fri Jul 21 11:17:46 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking In-Reply-To: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died a very agonizing and joyless death. On Jul 20, 2006, at 10:27 PM, James Ward wrote: > Hi all, > > Please ignore this message -- I'm just making sure I can still send > and receive messages from Buddha-L. > > Best wishes, > > James Ward > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > Jim Peavler jmp@peavler.org From bcarral at kungzhi.org Fri Jul 21 11:57:09 2006 From: bcarral at kungzhi.org (Benito Carral) Date: Fri Jul 21 11:57:20 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Re: Just checking In-Reply-To: References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <56299632.20060721195709@kungzhi.org> > I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died > a very agonizing and joyless death. Curious, I thought it's in deep samadhi, what is not so a bad thing for a Buddhist after all. Best wishes, -- Benito Carral Asturias, Sepharad (Spain) From curt at cola.iges.org Fri Jul 21 12:05:02 2006 From: curt at cola.iges.org (curt) Date: Fri Jul 21 12:05:23 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Re: Just checking In-Reply-To: <56299632.20060721195709@kungzhi.org> References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> <56299632.20060721195709@kungzhi.org> Message-ID: <44C1174E.6070706@cola.iges.org> I thought it was pining for the fjords. - Curt Benito Carral wrote: >> I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died >> a very agonizing and joyless death. >> > > Curious, I thought it's in deep samadhi, what is not > so a bad thing for a Buddhist after all. > > Best wishes, > > -- > Benito Carral > Asturias, Sepharad (Spain) > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > > > From smith at wheelwrightassoc.com Fri Jul 21 19:57:35 2006 From: smith at wheelwrightassoc.com (Timothy Smith) Date: Fri Jul 21 19:57:41 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking In-Reply-To: References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Yes, a victim of the Imam's of Impermanence. Man, I miss you and Hayes here, it was a bright spot that didn't need diminishing. And while I never fully understood what went down, all I can say is this place is the poorer for it. As we say out here in Carmel, "Too goddamn bad. Timothy Smith Wheelwright Associates www.wheelwrightassoc.com On Jul 21, 2006, at 10:11 AM, Jim Peavler wrote: > I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died a very > agonizing and joyless death. > > >> swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l >> > > Jim Peavler > jmp@peavler.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060721/95835574/attachment.html From jamesward at earthlink.net Sun Jul 23 02:58:21 2006 From: jamesward at earthlink.net (James Ward) Date: Sun Jul 23 02:58:29 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking In-Reply-To: References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <64721A3F-1A29-11DB-BE74-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Well, at least it is not like radio, where people need to keep talking all the time. With such a large membership, it may be a little unusual for everyone (of those who write) to stop writing all at once, even though most members of most listservs are quiet most of the time. This is a big community which has been around for years, and I would be frankly surprised if many, or even any, participants were to suddenly forget how valuable it is to have this space and to have each other to talk to. Some listservs are really quiet! But when communication does occur in them, it's a pleasure -- I don't expect that kind of very extensive silence to happen here, but whether it does or not, interacting here can be a pleasure. I'd be saying something right now, if I had anything to say, and as soon as I do, I will. Actually, I do have something to say: ecrasez l'infame. I wonder if part of the problem here is just the ongoing attempted saturation of our minds by the juggernaut enacted by our cold-hearted, colossally greedy and apparently insane human "leaders" around the world. But "only a Bodhisattva can lead another Bodhisattva astray," or something like that, so I guess they're doing us some kind of really big favor. Thanks a lot guys -- we could still have made a lot of progress without your input. Also it's been really hot -- stay cool, everybody, James On Jul 21, 2006, at 10:11 AM, Jim Peavler wrote: > I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died a very agonizing > and joyless death. From mike at lamrim.org.uk Sun Jul 23 03:26:44 2006 From: mike at lamrim.org.uk (Mike Austin) Date: Sun Jul 23 03:27:36 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking In-Reply-To: <64721A3F-1A29-11DB-BE74-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> <64721A3F-1A29-11DB-BE74-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: In message <64721A3F-1A29-11DB-BE74-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net>, James Ward writes >This is a big community which has been around for years, and I would be >frankly surprised if many, or even any, participants were to suddenly >forget how valuable it is to have this space and to have each other to >talk to. I value the opportunity for dialogue here but, being involved in running a Buddhist centre, I have plenty of opportunity in our evening meetings as well. Based on a particular text or topic, we have good discussions. We are joined in these discussions with our resident Geshe. I wonder how many of us have this opportunity as well? One advantage on this forum is that one can hear from a wider range of perspectives. And one advantage of our evening discussions is that they stay focussed and do not wander off topic. -- Metta Mike Austin From bcarral at kungzhi.org Sun Jul 23 05:01:40 2006 From: bcarral at kungzhi.org (Benito Carral) Date: Sun Jul 23 05:01:55 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Re: Just checking In-Reply-To: References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> <64721A3F-1A29-11DB-BE74-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <54426195.20060723130140@kungzhi.org> On Sunday, July 23, 2006, Mike Austin wrote: > Based on a particular text or topic, we have good > discussions. We are joined in these discussions with > our resident Geshe. I wonder how many of us have this > opportunity as well? I don't live near good masters or Dharma friends, so when I have some question, I ask my Dharma friends around the world (including masters, long-term practitioners, and scholars in several traditions). What I find most stimulating is to see my students struggling to incorporate Dharma in their daily lives and help them to do it. For example, last week I met a 19-year-old girl who is studying with me since one year ago--as we talked, she quoted some Master Linji's teachings we were dealing with during the last weeks--as the Zhaozhou bridge's spirit, what I found most pleasant. She is an adolescent idealist who is now starting to discover how the world really works (for example, she's discovering that Buddhism doesn't is like she imagined it is), but she's doing it from a Buddhist pov, which I think it's great. It's a great responsibility for me because I know that, as her Dharma teacher, I'm helping her to develop a long-term world view. For example, she always wanted to be a publicist (she studies audiovisual communication at university) and now she doesn't want to work for the advertising industry anymore but to be a investigative journalist. There is an old Jewish saying that goes like this, "I learned much from my teachers, more than that did I learn from my colleagues, but most of all from my students!" That's exactly right for me. I only miss taking root in a tradition and I'm working in order to handle it. It's not easy, but I consider it my main practice nowadays. Best wishes, -- Benito Carral Asturias, Sepharad (Spain) From jkirk at spro.net Mon Jul 24 07:28:04 2006 From: jkirk at spro.net (jkirk) Date: Mon Jul 24 07:28:08 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] New Publication from Columbia University Press Message-ID: <002a01c6af24$fe891d00$2930cece@charlie> X-posted by Joanna K. ==================== H-ASIA July 24, 2006 New Publication from Columbia University Press **************************** From: _pl2164@COLUMBIA.EDU_ (mailto:pl2164@COLUMBIA.EDU) Columbia University Press is pleased to announce the publication of Burton Watson's new translation of The Tales of the Heike. The Tales of the Heike Translated by Burton Watson; Edited by Haruo Shirane "Burton Watson is one of the premier translators of both Chinese and Japanese literature and history. His rendering into English of selected passages from The Tales of the Heike is a great boon for those of us in medieval Japanese studies. The translation provides an exciting new look at this famous tale of warrior and courtier life in late-twelfth-century Japan." ?Paul Varley, professor emeritus, Columbia University and Sen Soshitsu XV Professor Emeritus, University of Hawaii "This new abridged translation of The Tales of the Heike is one of the most approachable versions of this classic war tale; it retains the sense of sweep and grandeur of the original and includes extensive and valuable reference materials." ?H. Mack Horton, professor of East Asian languages and cultures, University of California, Berkeley "Watson's is... The best of the translations." ?Donald Richie, The Japan Times The Tales of the Heike is one of the most influential works in Japanese literature and culture, remaining even today a crucial source for fiction, drama, and popular media. Originally written in the mid-thirteenth century, it features a cast of vivid characters and chronicles the epic Genpei war, a civil conflict that marked the end of the power of the Heike and changed the course of Japanese history. The Tales of the Heike focuses on the lives of both the samurai warriors who fought for two powerful twelfth-century Japanese clans-the Heike (Taira) and the Genji (Minamoto)-and the women with whom they were intimately connected. The Tales of the Heike provides a dramatic window onto the emerging world of the medieval samurai and recounts in absorbing detail the chaos of the battlefield, the intrigue of the imperial court, and the gradual loss of a courtly tradition. The book is also highly religious and Buddhist in its orientation, taking up such issues as impermanence, karmic retribution, attachment, and renunciation, which dominated the Japanese imagination in the medieval period. In this new, abridged translation, Burton Watson offers a gripping rendering of the work's most memorable episodes. Particular to this translation are the introduction by Haruo Shirane, the woodblock illustrations, a glossary of characters, and an extended bibliography. To read an excerpt from The Tales of the Heike (http://www.columbia.edu/cu/cup/publicity/watsonexcerpt.pdf) About the translator Burton Watson has taught Chinese and Japanese literature at Columbia, Stanford, and Kyoto Universities. He is the winner of the PEN Translation Prize and in 2005 was awarded an American Academy of Arts and Letters Prize in literature. His translations include Chuang Tzu: Basic Writings, Ryokan: Zen Monk-Poet of Japan, and The Lotus Sutra, all published by Columbia University Press. He lives in Tokyo, Japan. Philip Leventhal Columbia University Press From rahula_80 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 24 08:19:23 2006 From: rahula_80 at yahoo.com (Ngawang Dorje) Date: Mon Jul 24 08:19:28 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Linji In-Reply-To: <002a01c6af24$fe891d00$2930cece@charlie> Message-ID: <20060724141923.46267.qmail@web30115.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi, Linji Yixuan is quoted to have said these: "If you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him! If you meet the patriarchs or the arhats on your way, kill them too... Bodhidharma was an old bearded barbarian... Nirvana and Bodhi are dead stumps to tie your donkey to. The sacred teachings are only lists of ghosts, sheets of paper fit for wiping the pus from your boils." Can anyone provide the source of reference? Thanks, Rahula --------------------------------- Groups are talking. We´re listening. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060724/1a07778f/attachment.htm From rahula_80 at yahoo.com Mon Jul 24 08:30:54 2006 From: rahula_80 at yahoo.com (Ngawang Dorje) Date: Mon Jul 24 08:31:01 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Burning the statue In-Reply-To: <20060724141923.46267.qmail@web30115.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060724143054.41644.qmail@web30107.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi, There is a Zen story of which a Zen priest burn a buddha-statue which I heard before. Anyone know the actual store? Thanks, Rahula --------------------------------- Groups are talking. We´re listening. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060724/e1d73a2d/attachment.html From franzmetcalf at earthlink.net Mon Jul 24 10:59:11 2006 From: franzmetcalf at earthlink.net (Franz Metcalf) Date: Mon Jul 24 10:59:34 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Linji In-Reply-To: <20060724141923.46267.qmail@web30115.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20060724141923.46267.qmail@web30115.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5e55870e151e20ae36262cfe0d3d5718@earthlink.net> Rahula et al., Those Linji quotes are from the Linjilu (Jap. Rinzairoku), the Record of Linji. A brief and tremendously entertaining book, it is also one of the most profound (perhaps anti-) spiritual works in the Buddhist tradition. I suggest you pick up the easily available and wonderfully vivid Burton Watson translation. Cheers, Franz On Jul 24, 2006, at 7:19 AM, Ngawang Dorje wrote: > Hi, > ? > Linji Yixuan? is quoted to have said these: > ? > "If you meet the Buddha on the road, kill him! > If you meet the patriarchs or the arhats on your way, kill them too... > Bodhidharma was an old bearded barbarian... > Nirvana and Bodhi are dead stumps to tie your donkey to. > The sacred teachings are only lists of ghosts, sheets of paper fit for > wiping the pus from your boils." > ? > Can anyone provide the source of reference? > ? > Thanks, > Rahula > > Groups are talking. We?re listening. Check out the handy changes to > Yahoo! Groups._______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l From tjs2 at columbia.edu Fri Jul 21 12:10:52 2006 From: tjs2 at columbia.edu (Toni J Sethi) Date: Tue Jul 25 07:04:07 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking In-Reply-To: References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Is Professor Hayes ok? Have not heard from him on this list for a long time. TS On Fri, 21 Jul 2006, Jim Peavler wrote: > I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died a very agonizing and > joyless death. > > > On Jul 20, 2006, at 10:27 PM, James Ward wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Please ignore this message -- I'm just making sure I can still send and >> receive messages from Buddha-L. >> >> Best wishes, >> >> James Ward >> >> _______________________________________________ >> buddha-l mailing list >> buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com >> http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l >> > > Jim Peavler > jmp@peavler.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l From mahaabaala at hotmail.com Tue Jul 18 15:25:28 2006 From: mahaabaala at hotmail.com (Michael Attwood) Date: Tue Jul 25 07:05:13 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) Message-ID: Would anyone be able to supply diacritics for the following mantra? ye dharma hetu prabhava hetum tesam tathagato aha tesam ca yo nirodha evam vadi mahasramanah 'ppreciate it. Jayarava _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN Search Toolbar now includes Desktop search! http://join.msn.com/toolbar/overview From yeshiuk at aol.com Tue Jul 25 07:54:07 2006 From: yeshiuk at aol.com (yeshiuk@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 25 08:09:23 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking In-Reply-To: References: <39F5ADDA-1871-11DB-9154-00039347DCC6@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <8C87E08EEDA2568-A98-B4B@mblk-d37.sysops.aol.com> Maybe he will, ironically, ressurect? Charles -----Original Message----- From: tjs2@columbia.edu To: buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com Sent: Fri, 21 Jul 2006 7.10PM Subject: Re: [Buddha-l] Just checking Is Professor Hayes ok? Have not heard from him on this list for a long time. TS On Fri, 21 Jul 2006, Jim Peavler wrote: > I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died a very agonizing and > joyless death. > > > On Jul 20, 2006, at 10:27 PM, James Ward wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Please ignore this message -- I'm just making sure I can still send and >> receive messages from Buddha-L. >> >> Best wishes, >> >> James Ward >> >> _______________________________________________ >> buddha-l mailing list >> buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com >> http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l >> > > Jim Peavler > jmp@peavler.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060725/6270b9cd/attachment.htm From 05010715 at hope.ac.uk Tue Jul 25 08:54:25 2006 From: 05010715 at hope.ac.uk (STEPHEN BAMBER) Date: Tue Jul 25 08:54:50 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking Message-ID: *tumbleweed blowing across the dry, arid plains* Ok heres the thing... Ive been off-list for a few months, and just recently re-started recieving posts again. When I left... There had been some complaints about Prof. Hayes moderating... it all seemed to happen off list so people like myself out of the off-list loop were left guessing... OK... so where are all the scholars now? Whats happened to all the wonderful, sparkling, informed discussion? And the gentle insults? Damn it I miss those especially. Very very sad indeed if JP's reports of Buddha -(hel)l's death are accurate. I'm sure I could trawl through the archives of past few months, but havent the heart. What gives? Hello? Hellooooooo? SJB >>> yeshiuk@aol.com 07/25/06 2:54 PM >>> Maybe he will, ironically, ressurect? Charles -----Original Message----- From: tjs2@columbia.edu To: buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com Sent: Fri, 21 Jul 2006 7.10PM Subject: Re: [Buddha-l] Just checking Is Professor Hayes ok? Have not heard from him on this list for a long time. TS On Fri, 21 Jul 2006, Jim Peavler wrote: > I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died a very agonizing and > joyless death. > > > On Jul 20, 2006, at 10:27 PM, James Ward wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Please ignore this message -- I'm just making sure I can still send and >> receive messages from Buddha-L. >> >> Best wishes, >> >> James Ward >> >> _______________________________________________ >> buddha-l mailing list >> buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com >> http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l >> > > Jim Peavler > jmp@peavler.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l From jinavamsa at yahoo.com Tue Jul 25 13:20:05 2006 From: jinavamsa at yahoo.com (Mitchell Ginsberg) Date: Tue Jul 25 13:20:16 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse In-Reply-To: <200607251800.k6PI0VC1010733@ns1.swcp.com> Message-ID: <20060725192005.58155.qmail@web60016.mail.yahoo.com> hello Michael/Jayarava/Mahaabaala and all, > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 21:25:28 +0000 > From: "Michael Attwood" > Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) > To: buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > > Would anyone be able to supply diacritics for the > following mantra? > > ye dharma hetu prabhava > hetum tesam tathagato aha > tesam ca yo nirodha > evam vadi mahasramanah > > 'ppreciate it. > Jayarava =============== Ah, what a lovely verse, the one that got Moggallaana and Sariputta! Leaving aside whether it's a mantra or not, the way it would read in Pali is: ye dhammaa hetupabhavaa tesa.m hetu.m tathaagataaha tesa.m ca yo nirodha eva.m vaadi mahaasama.no I think it can be found at DhA.i.92 and perhaps at Vin.i.40. I can't check those sources right now. Where did you run across Skt. version? Hope this helps. Mitchell/Jinavamsa ==================== http://www.geocities.com/jinavamsa/mentalhealth.html with links to my home page, info on The Inner Palace (new 4th ed.) and on The Far Shore (3rd ed.), further links to psychotherapy, to my current teaching, to the Insight Practice (Vipassana), Chishtiyya (Sufi), Creative Solutions for Peace, and Nasrudin discussion groups. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From 05010715 at hope.ac.uk Tue Jul 25 15:02:52 2006 From: 05010715 at hope.ac.uk (STEPHEN BAMBER) Date: Tue Jul 25 15:03:23 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Just checking Message-ID: I guess its time to go and see if those gap-toothed old Jesuits at Buddha-M will have me. 'You should k,now that all things are impermanen; coming together inevitable means parting. Do not be troubled, for this is the nature of life' Parinirvana Sutra So long, and thanks for all the fish... Steve B. >>> 05010715@hope.ac.uk 07/25/06 3:54 PM >>> *tumbleweed blowing across the dry, arid plains* Ok heres the thing... Ive been off-list for a few months, and just recently re-started recieving posts again. When I left... There had been some complaints about Prof. Hayes moderating... it all seemed to happen off list so people like myself out of the off-list loop were left guessing... OK... so where are all the scholars now? Whats happened to all the wonderful, sparkling, informed discussion? And the gentle insults? Damn it I miss those especially. Very very sad indeed if JP's reports of Buddha -(hel)l's death are accurate. I'm sure I could trawl through the archives of past few months, but havent the heart. What gives? Hello? Hellooooooo? SJB >>> yeshiuk@aol.com 07/25/06 2:54 PM >>> Maybe he will, ironically, ressurect? Charles -----Original Message----- From: tjs2@columbia.edu To: buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com Sent: Fri, 21 Jul 2006 7.10PM Subject: Re: [Buddha-l] Just checking Is Professor Hayes ok? Have not heard from him on this list for a long time. TS On Fri, 21 Jul 2006, Jim Peavler wrote: > I am very sorry, but buddha-hell appears to have died a very agonizing and > joyless death. > > > On Jul 20, 2006, at 10:27 PM, James Ward wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Please ignore this message -- I'm just making sure I can still send and >> receive messages from Buddha-L. >> >> Best wishes, >> >> James Ward >> >> _______________________________________________ >> buddha-l mailing list >> buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com >> http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l >> > > Jim Peavler > jmp@peavler.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l From richard.nance at gmail.com Tue Jul 25 15:54:10 2006 From: richard.nance at gmail.com (Richard Nance) Date: Tue Jul 25 15:54:17 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse In-Reply-To: <20060725192005.58155.qmail@web60016.mail.yahoo.com> References: <200607251800.k6PI0VC1010733@ns1.swcp.com> <20060725192005.58155.qmail@web60016.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi all. If BUDDHA-L is down for the count, then this may be a fitting way to go (textual colophons are among the many places in which this verse -- the dharma?ar?ra -- is found). There are different Sanskrit versions; one common one runs as follows: ye dharm? hetuprabhav? hetu? te??? tath?gato hy avadat / te??? ca yo nirodha eva?v?d? mah??rama?a? // I've used Unicode for the diacritics; hopefully this won't prove to be a stumbling block. For additional information, you may want to have a look at the following sources: Boucher, D. 1991. "The Prat?tyasamutp?dag?th? and its Role in the Medieval Cult of Relics" JIABS 14: 1-27. Skilling, P. 1999. "A Buddhist Inscription from Go Xoai, Southern Vietnam and Notes towards a classification of Ye Dharm? Inscriptions," 80 pi sasadachan dr. prasert na nakhon: ruam bot khwam wichakan dan charuk lae ekasan boran. Bangkok: 171-187 [80 Years: A Collection of Articles on Epigraphy and Ancient Documents Published on the Occasion of the Celebration of the 80th Birthday of Pr. Dr. Praser Na Nagra, 21 March 2542]. Sander, L. 2002. "An Unusual ye dharm? formula." In Braarvig, J. ed., Buddhist Manuscripts Volume II. Oslo: Hermes Publishing, pp. 337-349. Best wishes, R. Nance From mahaabaala at hotmail.com Tue Jul 25 14:26:45 2006 From: mahaabaala at hotmail.com (Michael Attwood) Date: Tue Jul 25 17:20:35 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse Message-ID: Mitchell Ginsberg wrote: >Ah, what a lovely verse, the one that got Moggallaana >and Sariputta! Leaving aside whether it's a mantra or >not, Ah yes, of course! It might be being used as a mantra in this case, although what is a mantra? The verse is included, I think, because it has some sort of magical significance in the context of the practice, so might as well call it a mantra. >I think it can be found at DhA.i.92 and perhaps at >Vin.i.40. I can't check those sources right now. I should be able to track it down. >Where did you run across Skt. version? It occurs in a Sadhana for White Tara written by a chap called Phabonkhapa (sorry the Tibetan spelling is probably a mess). The sadhana includes a visualisation of a Dharmacakra with a seed syallable at the hub, the tara mantra around that, and on the rim the vowels (anticlockwise), the consonants surrounding them (clockwise) and then outside that the verse above, and finally the whole thing surrounded by blue vajras. It's a reasonably common motif I think - similar to an image in the Mahavairocana Sutra anyway. Since I've been teaching myself the Siddham script and this visualisation is pretty difficult for folks who wouldn't recognise Sanskrit in a native script if it jumped up and bit them, I thought I'd do a calligraphy project on it. Technically it was probably not written in Siddham, but I like it on aesthetic grounds, and for the link to Kukai who I find inspiring. Unfortunately I've seen three versions of the verse and since I'm not sure what the correct Sanskrit is I've having to go with the version handed down to me, which is what traditionalists would have me do anyway. I know a little Pali, but almost no Sanskrit beyond common Buddhist technical terms - a fault which causes me chagrin on a regular basis - why don't they teach you stuff like this in school? >Hope this helps. Yes, thanks, it does :) Regards Jayarava _________________________________________________________________ Be the first to hear what's new at MSN - sign up to our free newsletters! http://www.msn.co.uk/newsletters From Bshmr at aol.com Tue Jul 25 17:48:13 2006 From: Bshmr at aol.com (Bshmr@aol.com) Date: Tue Jul 25 17:48:29 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Dog's Life Message-ID: <414.6c9b5f5.31f807bd@aol.com> Friends, or not, I am reminded of the time that I blew up, cussing the bloodsucking, starving army of fleas and ticks that the dog was bringing into the house, day after day, bedroom in particular. My old, dear dog heard me raising L, cussing, and carrying on louder and madder than I had before, or since for that matter. Inside the house was lousy with fleas and ticks. Well, he up and left on his own, out fear or hurt never did know. The fleas and ticks remained though. Some say they can survive seven years without blood, all I know is that they keep stealing enough of mine. As those buddhists say, I am still suffering; and, I am damned unhappy about it. Gonna fumigate the house, again; ain't gonna listen to buddhism according to fleas and ticks while they dine. Problem is still I miss the dog, it was a source of joy, a quiet companion at times, and even vigilant. Be nice to have the grungy stud return, but it does need flea and tick collars regularly as well as an occasional bath. Most of all, it needs to realize that bloodsucking persistent parasites are part of a dog's life but they really rile me and a few others. Richard Basham -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060725/08672cb9/attachment.htm From jkirk at spro.net Tue Jul 25 18:44:11 2006 From: jkirk at spro.net (jkirk) Date: Tue Jul 25 18:44:12 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Dog's Life References: <414.6c9b5f5.31f807bd@aol.com> Message-ID: <005601c6b04c$9d1b6860$2930cece@charlie> Well Richard, If you had taken good care of your dog companion earlier on, he would not have been loaded with fleas and ticks. Probably took off to find a person who'd relieve him of the fleas and ticks. Since you miss your old dog, find another dog to companion with, and take care of that one. Joanna ----- Original Message ----- From: Bshmr@aol.com To: buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2006 5:48 PM Subject: [Buddha-l] Dog's Life Friends, or not, I am reminded of the time that I blew up, cussing the bloodsucking, starving army of fleas and ticks that the dog was bringing into the house, day after day, bedroom in particular. My old, dear dog heard me raising L, cussing, and carrying on louder and madder than I had before, or since for that matter. Inside the house was lousy with fleas and ticks. Well, he up and left on his own, out fear or hurt never did know. The fleas and ticks remained though. Some say they can survive seven years without blood, all I know is that they keep stealing enough of mine. As those buddhists say, I am still suffering; and, I am damned unhappy about it. Gonna fumigate the house, again; ain't gonna listen to buddhism according to fleas and ticks while they dine. Problem is still I miss the dog, it was a source of joy, a quiet companion at times, and even vigilant. Be nice to have the grungy stud return, but it does need flea and tick collars regularly as well as an occasional bath. Most of all, it needs to realize that bloodsucking persistent parasites are part of a dog's life but they really rile me and a few others. Richard Basham ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/396 - Release Date: 7/24/2006 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060725/6e32fa73/attachment.htm From selwyn at ntlworld.com Wed Jul 26 00:10:39 2006 From: selwyn at ntlworld.com (L.S. Cousins) Date: Wed Jul 26 00:48:47 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse In-Reply-To: <20060725192005.58155.qmail@web60016.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20060725192005.58155.qmail@web60016.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi there, Jinavamsa after a long while . . . >=============== >Ah, what a lovely verse, the one that got Moggallaana >and Sariputta! Leaving aside whether it's a mantra or >not, the way it would read in Pali is: > >ye dhammaa hetupabhavaa >tesa.m hetu.m tathaagataaha >tesa.m ca yo nirodha >eva.m vaadi mahaasama.no I make it: ye dhammaa hetuppabhavaa, tesa.m hetu.m tathaagato aaha. tesa? ca yo nirodho, eva.mvaadii mahaasama.no >I think it can be found at DhA.i.92 and perhaps at >Vin.i.40. I can't check those sources right now. The oldest Pali sources I have are: Vin I 40 & 41; Ap I 25; Pe.t 10 It is cited in around a dozen later texts, mostly just the first three words but sometimes in full. And as has been mentioned, there are many occurrences in inscriptions in Sanskrit, Pali and what are presumably other forms of Middle Indian. Lance Cousins From alex at chagchen.org Tue Jul 25 18:18:05 2006 From: alex at chagchen.org (Alex Wilding) Date: Wed Jul 26 06:54:08 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse (or rather, usage) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000d01c6b048$f7aaaf10$0200000a@Tsogyal> Although it does not satisfy the classical criteria of a mantra, it is very commonly used after, for instance, reciting a whole bunch of mantras. In that context, there are three things recited one after each other, treated almost as a single item: 1) the Sanskrit alphabet (in some sort of pronunciation) 2) the 100-syllable mantra of Vajrasattva and 3) the verse in question. This is said to compensate for any imperfections in whatever has just preceded it. In this usage there in not much focus on its meaning, though I think the serious practitioner would be expected to know. It has, therefore (and again I say *in this context*) at least some things in common with a mantra. Perhaps it would be thought of as a dharani? All the best Alex W From curt at cola.iges.org Wed Jul 26 12:14:43 2006 From: curt at cola.iges.org (curt) Date: Wed Jul 26 12:14:57 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse (or rather, usage) In-Reply-To: <000d01c6b048$f7aaaf10$0200000a@Tsogyal> References: <000d01c6b048$f7aaaf10$0200000a@Tsogyal> Message-ID: <44C7B113.2090008@cola.iges.org> In Korean Buddhism there is a mantra that is sometimes called "the extra mantra" - it goes like this: om ho-ro ho-ro saya mot-kye sabaha Its name is "bo gwol jin on". I don't know what "bo gwol" means, but "jin on" is the Korean Buddhist term for mantra, it literally means something like "true" (jin) "words" (on). The Korean Zen Master Seung Sahn told his western students that this mantra is "the extra extra" - his explanation was that it is "like the extra button sewed into a shirt - just in case." I can't verify how closely this fits with its traditionally understood meaning in Korea. This particular mantra is used in a long chant that consists of first honoring/"invoking" the Buddha, Dharma and Sangha, then chanting "Kwan Seum Bosal" 108 times, then chanting a series of mantras and one dharani 3 times each (each mantra or dharani is preceded by its name or title - that's how you can tell one of them is a dharani - because Koreans call a dharani a "da-ra-ni"). The "extra" mantra is the next to last one (fittingly) - it's supposed to make up for any mistakes made while doing the rest of the chant. Then a mantra for "sharing merit" comes last. The above "Koreanized" mantra appears (to my untrained eye) to be unrelated to the Sanskrit mantra in question. But according to Alex's explanation they have a very similar function. - Curt Alex Wilding wrote: > Although it does not satisfy the classical criteria of a mantra, it is very > commonly used after, for instance, reciting a whole bunch of mantras. In > that context, there are three things recited one after each other, treated > almost as a single item: 1) the Sanskrit alphabet (in some sort of > pronunciation) 2) the 100-syllable mantra of Vajrasattva and 3) the verse in > question. > This is said to compensate for any imperfections in whatever has just > preceded it. In this usage there in not much focus on its meaning, though I > think the serious practitioner would be expected to know. It has, therefore > (and again I say *in this context*) at least some things in common with a > mantra. Perhaps it would be thought of as a dharani? > All the best > Alex W > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > > > From jion at tendai-lotus.org Wed Jul 26 12:28:03 2006 From: jion at tendai-lotus.org (Jion Prosser) Date: Wed Jul 26 12:28:07 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Buddhist mantras for imperfections made in practice In-Reply-To: <000d01c6b048$f7aaaf10$0200000a@Tsogyal> Message-ID: <00c401c6b0e1$3c1495b0$0200a8c0@triwave2> Greetings, I was quite interested in Alex W's insight below: >This is said to compensate for any imperfections in whatever has just >preceded it. In our Japanese Tendai tradition, we have a (similar?) mantra used to make up for such imperfections and mistakes in one's practice. Does anyone else on the list from diverse traditions have experience with such a mantra? Gassho- Rev. Jion Prosser www.tendai-lotus.org >Tuesday, July 25, 2006 5:18 PM >Although it does not satisfy the classical criteria of a mantra, it is very >commonly used after, for instance, reciting a whole bunch of mantras. In >that context, there are three things recited one after each other, treated >almost as a single item: 1) the Sanskrit alphabet (in some sort of >pronunciation) 2) the 100-syllable mantra of Vajrasattva and 3) the verse >in question. >This is said to compensate for any imperfections in whatever has just >preceded it. In this usage there in not much focus on its meaning, though I >think the serious practitioner would be expected to know. It has, therefore >(and again I say *in this context*) at least some things in common with a >mantra. Perhaps it would be thought of as a dharani? >All the best >Alex W From jinavamsa at yahoo.com Wed Jul 26 13:07:30 2006 From: jinavamsa at yahoo.com (Mitchell Ginsberg) Date: Wed Jul 26 13:07:35 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Re: diacritics for verse (L.S. Cousins) In-Reply-To: <200607261800.k6QI0VJs013160@ns1.swcp.com> Message-ID: <20060726190730.1278.qmail@web60020.mail.yahoo.com> Hello Lance and all, Hello indeed! And thank you for fine-tuning my transcription. And also the comments about the role of that as a mantra/dharani from Alex. Any information on Richard Hayes and whether he is on vacation ....? Mitchell/Jinavamsa ==================== http://www.geocities.com/jinavamsa/mentalhealth.html with links to my home page, info on The Inner Palace (new 4th ed.) and on The Far Shore (3rd ed.), further links to psychotherapy, to my current teaching, to the Insight Practice (Vipassana), Chishtiyya (Sufi), Creative Solutions for Peace, and Nasrudin discussion groups. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From mike at lamrim.org.uk Wed Jul 26 15:19:29 2006 From: mike at lamrim.org.uk (Mike Austin) Date: Wed Jul 26 15:19:51 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse (or rather, usage) In-Reply-To: <44C7B113.2090008@cola.iges.org> References: <000d01c6b048$f7aaaf10$0200000a@Tsogyal> <44C7B113.2090008@cola.iges.org> Message-ID: <7n$12CQhx9xEFwWY@clara.net> In message <44C7B113.2090008@cola.iges.org>, curt writes >In Korean Buddhism there is a mantra that is sometimes called "the >extra mantra" - it goes like this: > >om ho-ro ho-ro saya mot-kye sabaha > This reminds me of the mind-training mantra for giving and taking. There are two parts representing giving happiness (the sun - gold) and taking suffering (the moon - silver). The practice of taking has the mantra: om yo hoho anna bota lovrum In Tibetan, the full practice is known as long-jong and this, the taking part, is thus the long-jong silver mantra. -- Metta Mike Austin From ellwbj at nus.edu.sg Wed Jul 26 18:32:29 2006 From: ellwbj at nus.edu.sg (John Whalen-Bridge) Date: Wed Jul 26 18:32:36 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] What's in a mantra? References: <200607261800.k6QI0VJt013160@ns1.swcp.com> Message-ID: -----Original Message----- From: buddha-l-bounces@mailman.swcp.com on behalf of buddha-l-request@mailman.swcp.com Sent: Wed 7/26/2006 11:00 AM To: buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com Subject: buddha-l Digest, Vol 17, Issue 11 Send buddha-l mailing list submissions to buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to buddha-l-request@mailman.swcp.com You can reach the person managing the list at buddha-l-owner@mailman.swcp.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of buddha-l digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: diacritics for verse (L.S. Cousins) 2. RE: diacritics for verse (or rather, usage) (Alex Wilding) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 07:10:39 +0100 From: "L.S. Cousins" Subject: Re: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse To: Buddhist discussion forum Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Hi there, Jinavamsa after a long while . . . >=============== >Ah, what a lovely verse, the one that got Moggallaana >and Sariputta! Leaving aside whether it's a mantra or >not, the way it would read in Pali is: > >ye dhammaa hetupabhavaa >tesa.m hetu.m tathaagataaha >tesa.m ca yo nirodha >eva.m vaadi mahaasama.no I make it: ye dhammaa hetuppabhavaa, tesa.m hetu.m tathaagato aaha. tesa? ca yo nirodho, eva.mvaadii mahaasama.no >I think it can be found at DhA.i.92 and perhaps at >Vin.i.40. I can't check those sources right now. The oldest Pali sources I have are: Vin I 40 & 41; Ap I 25; Pe.t 10 It is cited in around a dozen later texts, mostly just the first three words but sometimes in full. And as has been mentioned, there are many occurrences in inscriptions in Sanskrit, Pali and what are presumably other forms of Middle Indian. Lance Cousins ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:18:05 +1000 From: "Alex Wilding" Subject: RE: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse (or rather, usage) To: "'Buddhist discussion forum'" Message-ID: <000d01c6b048$f7aaaf10$0200000a@Tsogyal> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Although it does not satisfy the classical criteria of a mantra, it is very commonly used after, for instance, reciting a whole bunch of mantras. In that context, there are three things recited one after each other, treated almost as a single item: 1) the Sanskrit alphabet (in some sort of pronunciation) 2) the 100-syllable mantra of Vajrasattva and 3) the verse in question. This is said to compensate for any imperfections in whatever has just preceded it. In this usage there in not much focus on its meaning, though I think the serious practitioner would be expected to know. It has, therefore (and again I say *in this context*) at least some things in common with a mantra. Perhaps it would be thought of as a dharani? All the best Alex W ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l End of buddha-l Digest, Vol 17, Issue 11 **************************************** Dear Alex, Could you tell this poor non-Buddhologist what the classical criteria for a mantra are? There might be an interesting thread about where such criteria come from and how some "non-mantras" have been excluded. Do northern and southern buddhisms have different standards? I once attended a lecture by the Ninjitsu teacher Stephen Hayes (American Buddhism Conference in ...San Diego? 1998?), a man who was apparently a body guard of some sort for the Dalai Lama and is a Shingon teacher of some sort, & he defined a mantra as a "mind protective device." He said everyone uses mantras, and one of the most common in America is "fuck it." One says this repeatedly during the day to ward off frustration about those things one can't help much. He was being a bit tongue-in-cheek to point out that mantra, as a mental strategy, is less exotic than it may at first seem. But, anyway, how do we know a mantra when we see one? How does one tell a mantra froma dharani? Can one breed a mantra and a dharani and come up with a madhrani or a dhantra? I hope my question isn't too sub-Buddhological, but enquiring minds want to know want to know want to know want to know.... (x 108) Thanks kindly, John Whalen-Bridge Message: 2 Date: Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:18:05 +1000 From: "Alex Wilding" Subject: RE: [Buddha-l] diacritics for verse (or rather, usage) Although it does not satisfy the classical criteria of a mantra, it is very commonly used after, for instance, reciting a whole bunch of mantras. In that context, there are three things recited one after each other, treated almost as a single item: 1) the Sanskrit alphabet (in some sort of pronunciation) 2) the 100-syllable mantra of Vajrasattva and 3) the verse in question. This is said to compensate for any imperfections in whatever has just preceded it. In this usage there in not much focus on its meaning, though I think the serious practitioner would be expected to know. It has, therefore (and again I say *in this context*) at least some things in common with a mantra. Perhaps it would be thought of as a dharani? All the best Alex W From jinavamsa at yahoo.com Wed Jul 26 23:18:36 2006 From: jinavamsa at yahoo.com (Mitchell Ginsberg) Date: Wed Jul 26 23:18:39 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Q on citation Re: diacritics for verse (L.S. Cousins) In-Reply-To: <200607261800.k6QI0VJs013160@ns1.swcp.com> Message-ID: <20060727051836.35732.qmail@web60015.mail.yahoo.com> Hello Lance and all, Quick question on your citations: > The oldest Pali sources I have are: > Vin I 40 & 41; Ap I 25; Pe.t 10 I understand the first two as Vinaya and Apadaana, but cannot tell what the third abbreviated as Pe.t would be. Not Pe.takopadesa or Pe.takaalankara, either, I assume. Thanks for all clarifications. Mitchell/Jinavamsa ==================== http://www.geocities.com/jinavamsa/mentalhealth.html with links to my home page, info on The Inner Palace (new 4th ed.) and on The Far Shore (3rd ed.), further links to psychotherapy, to my current teaching, to the Insight Practice (Vipassana), Chishtiyya (Sufi), Creative Solutions for Peace, and Nasrudin discussion groups. __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From selwyn at ntlworld.com Thu Jul 27 00:18:51 2006 From: selwyn at ntlworld.com (L.S. Cousins) Date: Thu Jul 27 00:19:33 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Q on citation Re: diacritics for verse (L.S. Cousins) In-Reply-To: <20060727051836.35732.qmail@web60015.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20060727051836.35732.qmail@web60015.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Jinavamsa, >I understand the first two as Vinaya and Apadaana, but >cannot tell what the third abbreviated as Pe.t would >be. Not Pe.takopadesa or Pe.takaalankara, either, I >assume. Thanks for all clarifications. It is indeed the work known as Pe.taka or Pe.takopadesa. Lance Cousins From bclough at aucegypt.edu Thu Jul 27 07:15:52 2006 From: bclough at aucegypt.edu (bclough) Date: Thu Jul 27 07:20:25 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) Message-ID: Frombuddha-l-bounces@mailman.swcp.com Tobuddha-l@mailman.swcp.com Cc DateTue, 18 Jul 2006 21:25:28 +0000 Subject[Buddha-l] (no subject) > Would anyone be able to supply diacritics for the following mantra? > > ye dharma hetu prabhava > hetum tesam tathagato aha > tesam ca yo nirodha > evam vadi mahasramanah > > 'ppreciate it. > Jayarava > > _________________________________________________________________ > The new MSN Search Toolbar now includes Desktop search! > http://join.msn.com/toolbar/overview > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l Bradley Clough (bclough@aucegypt.edu)/202-797-6122 Abdulhadi H. Taher Professor of Comparative Religion History Department (Postal Code #221) The American University in Cairo 113 Kasr El Aini Street, P.O. Box 2511 Cairo 11511 Egypt -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060727/854ecdc5/attachment-0001.html From jkirk at spro.net Thu Jul 27 07:41:26 2006 From: jkirk at spro.net (jkirk) Date: Thu Jul 27 07:41:24 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) References: Message-ID: <002001c6b182$5be4e470$2930cece@charlie> joking aside......??there is no message here?? ----- Original Message ----- From: bclough To: buddha-l Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 7:15 AM Subject: Re:[Buddha-l] (no subject) From buddha-l-bounces@mailman.swcp.com To buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com Cc Date Tue, 18 Jul 2006 21:25:28 +0000 Subject [Buddha-l] (no subject) > Would anyone be able to supply diacritics for the following mantra? > > ye dharma hetu prabhava > hetum tesam tathagato aha > tesam ca yo nirodha > evam vadi mahasramanah > > 'ppreciate it. > Jayarava > > _________________________________________________________________ > The new MSN Search Toolbar now includes Desktop search! > http://join.msn.com/toolbar/overview > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l Bradley Clough (bclough@aucegypt.edu)/202-797-6122 Abdulhadi H. Taher Professor of Comparative Religion History Department (Postal Code #221) The American University in Cairo 113 Kasr El Aini Street, P.O. Box 2511 Cairo 11511 Egypt ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/399 - Release Date: 7/25/2006 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060727/367954ff/attachment.html From jkirk at spro.net Thu Jul 27 07:43:59 2006 From: jkirk at spro.net (jkirk) Date: Thu Jul 27 07:43:56 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) Message-ID: <002e01c6b182$b7218550$2930cece@charlie> joking aside......??there is no message here?? Also your email address is getting rejected by the server, Brad......if I don't delete it from this post it will again be rejected too Joanna ----- Original Message ----- From: brad clough To: buddha-l Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 7:15 AM Subject: Re:[Buddha-l] (no subject) From buddha-l-bounces@mailman.swcp.com To buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com Cc Date Tue, 18 Jul 2006 21:25:28 +0000 Subject [Buddha-l] (no subject) > Would anyone be able to supply diacritics for the following mantra? > > ye dharma hetu prabhava > hetum tesam tathagato aha > tesam ca yo nirodha > evam vadi mahasramanah > > 'ppreciate it. > Jayarava > > _________________________________________________________________ > The new MSN Search Toolbar now includes Desktop search! > http://join.msn.com/toolbar/overview > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l Bradley Clough 202-797-6122 Abdulhadi H. Taher Professor of Comparative Religion History Department (Postal Code #221) The American University in Cairo 113 Kasr El Aini Street, P.O. Box 2511 Cairo 11511 Egypt ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/399 - Release Date: 7/25/2006 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060727/b1008662/attachment.htm From curt at cola.iges.org Thu Jul 27 07:46:49 2006 From: curt at cola.iges.org (curt) Date: Thu Jul 27 07:47:05 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Buddhist mantras for imperfections made in practice In-Reply-To: <00c401c6b0e1$3c1495b0$0200a8c0@triwave2> References: <00c401c6b0e1$3c1495b0$0200a8c0@triwave2> Message-ID: <44C8C3C9.9030904@cola.iges.org> What is the Tendai mantra "to make up for imperfections"? I am very interested to know whether it bears any similarity to the mantra that I know from Korean Buddhism that serves the same purpose. I am asking because this is a mantra which I need a lot! - Curt Jion Prosser wrote: > Greetings, > > I was quite interested in Alex W's insight below: > > >> This is said to compensate for any imperfections in whatever has just >> preceded it. >> > > In our Japanese Tendai tradition, we have a (similar?) mantra used to make > up for such imperfections and mistakes in one's practice. Does anyone else > on the list from diverse traditions have experience with such a mantra? > > Gassho- > Rev. Jion Prosser > www.tendai-lotus.org > > > >> Tuesday, July 25, 2006 5:18 PM >> > > >> Although it does not satisfy the classical criteria of a mantra, it is very >> commonly used after, for instance, reciting a whole bunch of mantras. In >> that context, there are three things recited one after each other, treated >> almost as a single item: 1) the Sanskrit alphabet (in some sort of >> pronunciation) 2) the 100-syllable mantra of Vajrasattva and 3) the verse >> in question. >> This is said to compensate for any imperfections in whatever has just >> preceded it. In this usage there in not much focus on its meaning, though I >> think the serious practitioner would be expected to know. It has, therefore >> (and again I say *in this context*) at least some things in common with a >> mantra. Perhaps it would be thought of as a dharani? >> All the best >> Alex W >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > > > From jmp at peavler.org Thu Jul 27 09:07:49 2006 From: jmp at peavler.org (Jim Peavler) Date: Thu Jul 27 09:10:49 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <002001c6b182$5be4e470$2930cece@charlie> References: <002001c6b182$5be4e470$2930cece@charlie> Message-ID: <9203BB67-0350-44A7-9D71-60C13C9D1D6A@peavler.org> This is a "bounce", which means that the mail server at Bradley Clough's location (bclough@aucegypt.edu) rejected the message for some reason (mailbox full, no longer an account at that address, etc.) The bounced message is the original question about the Mantra. normally bounces go only to the buddha-l-owner, but for some reason this one escaped. I will try to figure out what is happening and to prevent such annoyances in the future. Jim Peavler jmp@peavler.org On Jul 27, 2006, at 7:41 AM, jkirk wrote: > joking aside......??there is no message here?? > ----- Original Message ----- > From: bclough > To: buddha-l > Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 7:15 AM > Subject: Re:[Buddha-l] (no subject) > > > Frombuddha-l-bounces@mailman.swcp.com > Tobuddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > Cc > DateTue, 18 Jul 2006 21:25:28 +0000 > Subject[Buddha-l] (no subject) > > > Would anyone be able to supply diacritics for the following mantra? > > > > ye dharma hetu prabhava > > hetum tesam tathagato aha > > tesam ca yo nirodha > > evam vadi mahasramanah > > > > 'ppreciate it. > > Jayarava > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > The new MSN Search Toolbar now includes Desktop search! > > http://join.msn.com/toolbar/overview > > > > _______________________________________________ > > buddha-l mailing list > > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > > > Bradley Clough (bclough@aucegypt.edu)/202-797-6122 > Abdulhadi H. Taher Professor of Comparative Religion > History Department (Postal Code #221) > The American University in Cairo > 113 Kasr El Aini Street, P.O. Box 2511 > Cairo 11511 Egypt > > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/399 - Release Date: > 7/25/2006 > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l From jkirk at spro.net Thu Jul 27 10:06:03 2006 From: jkirk at spro.net (jkirk) Date: Thu Jul 27 10:06:01 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) References: <002001c6b182$5be4e470$2930cece@charlie> <9203BB67-0350-44A7-9D71-60C13C9D1D6A@peavler.org> Message-ID: <000f01c6b196$8fa90f70$2930cece@charlie> Sorry for making trouble----I actually thought he'd intended to send a message. Joanna ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Peavler" To: "Buddhist discussion forum" Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 9:07 AM Subject: Re: [Buddha-l] (no subject) > This is a "bounce", which means that the mail server at Bradley Clough's > location (bclough@aucegypt.edu) rejected the message for some reason > (mailbox full, no longer an account at that address, etc.) The bounced > message is the original question about the Mantra. normally bounces go > only to the buddha-l-owner, but for some reason this one escaped. I will > try to figure out what is happening and to prevent such annoyances in the > future. > > Jim Peavler > jmp@peavler.org > > > > On Jul 27, 2006, at 7:41 AM, jkirk wrote: > >> joking aside......??there is no message here?? >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: bclough >> To: buddha-l >> Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2006 7:15 AM >> Subject: Re:[Buddha-l] (no subject) >> >> >> Frombuddha-l-bounces@mailman.swcp.com >> Tobuddha-l@mailman.swcp.com >> Cc >> DateTue, 18 Jul 2006 21:25:28 +0000 >> Subject[Buddha-l] (no subject) >> >> > Would anyone be able to supply diacritics for the following mantra? >> > >> > ye dharma hetu prabhava >> > hetum tesam tathagato aha >> > tesam ca yo nirodha >> > evam vadi mahasramanah >> > >> > 'ppreciate it. >> > Jayarava >> > >> > _________________________________________________________________ >> > The new MSN Search Toolbar now includes Desktop search! >> > http://join.msn.com/toolbar/overview >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > buddha-l mailing list >> > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com >> > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l >> >> >> Bradley Clough (bclough@aucegypt.edu)/202-797-6122 >> Abdulhadi H. Taher Professor of Comparative Religion >> History Department (Postal Code #221) >> The American University in Cairo >> 113 Kasr El Aini Street, P.O. Box 2511 >> Cairo 11511 Egypt >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> buddha-l mailing list >> buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com >> http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l >> >> >> No virus found in this incoming message. >> Checked by AVG Free Edition. >> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/399 - Release Date: >> 7/25/2006 >> _______________________________________________ >> buddha-l mailing list >> buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com >> http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > > > > > _______________________________________________ > buddha-l mailing list > buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com > http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/399 - Release Date: 7/25/2006 > > From jion at tendai-lotus.org Thu Jul 27 10:54:59 2006 From: jion at tendai-lotus.org (Jion Prosser) Date: Thu Jul 27 10:55:10 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Buddhist mantras for imperfections made in practice In-Reply-To: <44C8C3C9.9030904@cola.iges.org> Message-ID: <008301c6b19d$65fe3c20$0200a8c0@triwave2> >What is the Tendai mantra "to make up for imperfections"? I am very >interested to know whether it bears any similarity to the mantra that I >know from Korean Buddhism that serves the same purpose. I am asking >because this is a mantra which I need a lot! >- Curt Greetings Curt and Members, The Tendai tradition implements the DAIKONGO-RIN mantra, the exoteric form of which is: Namah stryadhivikaanaam sarva tathaagataanaam om viraji viraji mahaa cakra vajri satasata saarate saarate trayii trayii vidamani sambhanjani tramati siddhagriye tram svaha. Oral commentaries (kuden) exist which are transmitted from Master to acolyte detailing the use, corresponding hand mudra and mind visualization. Gassho, Rev. Jion Prosser Tendai Lotus Teachings www.tendai-lotus.org -----Original Message----- [[JP]] >> In our Japanese Tendai tradition, we have a (similar?) mantra used to make >> up for such imperfections and mistakes in one's practice. Does anyone else >> on the list from diverse traditions have experience with such a mantra? From mahaabaala at hotmail.com Thu Jul 27 14:03:23 2006 From: mahaabaala at hotmail.com (Michael Attwood) Date: Thu Jul 27 14:07:27 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) Message-ID: Alex Wilding alex at chagchen.org Tue Jul 25 18:18:05 MDT 2006 Wrote: >Although it does not satisfy the classical criteria of a mantra, Say more. I'd be interested in what you mean by "classical" - classical according to which culture, religion, time or place? I've only ever seen contention and dispute amongst scholars of mantra, so am pleased to learn that there is now a set of criteria by which to assess a mantra. >Perhaps it would be thought of as a dharani? How would you make the distinction? I think it most closely resembles a paritta, and given it's Pali Canon roots perhaps this would be the best definition - although the word had disappeared from use (so far as I've been able to make out) by the time the Mahayana texts were written, the function of protecting by recitation of a text remained. In the sadhana I am referring to it surrounds the consonants and vowels and so does function as protection - with a row of vajras outside that doing the same thing. The irony is that the Vajrayanists, so dismissive of the so-called "Hinayana", topped off their Vedic-derived ritual with a "Hinayana" protective spell. Nice. BTW I appreciate the various diacritics that people have added to my previously naked verse - it does look a lot better with the dots :) _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live™ Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb From alex at chagchen.org Fri Jul 28 00:55:28 2006 From: alex at chagchen.org (Alex Wilding) Date: Fri Jul 28 00:55:52 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <001801c6b212$cfa59a90$0200000a@Tsogyal> Michael Attwood, in response to my: > >Although it does not satisfy the classical criteria of a mantra, wrote: > Say more. I'd be interested in what you mean by "classical" - classical > according to which culture, religion, time or place? A) Tibetan. B) Buddhism. C) Recent centuries D) Tibet and, more recently, western cultures. I had rashly assumed that my reference to the 100-syllable Vajrasattva mantra would make that clear - sorry. > I've only ever seen > contention and dispute amongst scholars of mantra, so am pleased to learn > that there is now a set of criteria by which to assess a mantra. I infer, from your implication that the existence of the criteria that I had in mind is both novel and pleasing, that you are being sarcastic, so I'll move on from there. You can call it a mantra if you like, of course. Its structure and usage, however, remain at least a little atypical in the context I mention. > ... given it's Pali Canon roots Prior to the discussion here in recent days I had only come across citations of the verse as Sanskrit. Or did you mean the word "paritta"? All the best Alex W From rahula_80 at yahoo.com Fri Jul 28 11:40:06 2006 From: rahula_80 at yahoo.com (Ngawang Dorje) Date: Fri Jul 28 11:40:10 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Overcoming the world In-Reply-To: <20060727051836.35732.qmail@web60015.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060728174006.9742.qmail@web30109.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi, An ancient verse ascribed to the Buddha in the Questions of King Milinda says: Not far from here do you need to look! Highest existence ? what can it avail? Here in this present aggregate, In your own body overcome the world! Anyone know where exactly is this verse to be found in the Milindapanha and the Tipitaka? Thanks, Rahula --------------------------------- Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1?/min. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060728/df3a906e/attachment.html From selwyn at ntlworld.com Fri Jul 28 12:01:29 2006 From: selwyn at ntlworld.com (L.S. Cousins) Date: Fri Jul 28 12:01:59 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Overcoming the world In-Reply-To: <20060728174006.9742.qmail@web30109.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20060728174006.9742.qmail@web30109.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Rahula, It is found on page 393 of Mil. It is attributed to the Buddha, but I don't think it is found in the Canon. Lance Cousins >An ancient verse ascribed to the Buddha in the Questions of King Milinda says: >Not far from here do you need to look! >Highest existence ? what can it avail? >Here in this present aggregate, >In your own body overcome the world! > >Anyone know where exactly is this verse to be found in the >Milindapanha and the Tipitaka? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060728/03ebc2c4/attachment.htm From brburl at mailbag.com Fri Jul 28 14:00:31 2006 From: brburl at mailbag.com (Bruce Burrill) Date: Fri Jul 28 14:00:41 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Overcoming the world In-Reply-To: References: <20060728174006.9742.qmail@web30109.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20060728145959.034174e0@mailbag.com> "it is in this fathomlong body with its perceptions and thoughts that there is the world, the origin of the world, the cessation of the world, and the path leading to the cessation of the world." (A II 48; S I 62). From bclough at aucegypt.edu Fri Jul 28 23:44:42 2006 From: bclough at aucegypt.edu (bclough) Date: Fri Jul 28 23:49:15 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Apologies Message-ID: Joanna Kirk: > Sorry for making trouble----I actually thought he'd intended to send a message. > Joanna > >Jim Peavler: > > This is a "bounce", which means that the mail server at Bradley >>Clough's location rejected the message for some reason...I will > > try to figure out what is happening and to prevent such >>annoyances in the > > future. Sorry folks, the annoyance was caused by my accidently hitting "send" itstead of delete. Will be more careful in the future. Brad Clough From rahula_80 at yahoo.com Sat Jul 29 10:02:14 2006 From: rahula_80 at yahoo.com (Ngawang Dorje) Date: Sat Jul 29 10:02:18 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Dhammapada In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20060728145959.034174e0@mailbag.com> Message-ID: <20060729160214.7235.qmail@web30105.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi, I am looking for the commentary to the Dhammapada. I have with me Buddhist Legends by Eugene Watson Burlingame. However, I find this translation too archaic. I am thinking of getting The Dhammapada by John Ross Carter and Mahinda Palihawadana. I understand that it includes the commentary. Is it true? The price make it sonds too good to be true. Some reviews from Amazon.com: "In addition to the text, this translation includes line-by-line translations of the earliest Sri Lankan commentaries on the Dhammapada." "The layout of the book is of three parts: Introduction, The Text and the Text With Transliteration and Commentary." Best wishes, Rahula --------------------------------- Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2?/min or less. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060729/56d31334/attachment.htm From rahula_80 at yahoo.com Sat Jul 29 10:24:59 2006 From: rahula_80 at yahoo.com (Ngawang Dorje) Date: Sat Jul 29 10:25:03 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Metteyya In-Reply-To: <20060729160214.7235.qmail@web30105.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060729162459.91378.qmail@web30113.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi, "Our cycle is a happy one, three leaders have already lived . . . The Buddha supreme am I, but after me, Metteyya comes. While still this happy cycle lasts, before its tale of years shall lapse. This Buddha, called Metteyya, shall be supreme chief of all Men." [Henry C. Warren, Buddhism in translation, p.481-82] If I read correctly, it is a translation from the Anagatavamsa. However, I couldn?t find the passage here: http://www.ubakhin.com/uchittin/arimet/ARIMET09.html Anyone know the source of the passage? Thanks, Rahula --------------------------------- Groups are talking. We´re listening. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060729/7c8db962/attachment.htm From jkirk at spro.net Sat Jul 29 13:48:08 2006 From: jkirk at spro.net (jkirk) Date: Sat Jul 29 13:47:59 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Metteyya References: <20060729162459.91378.qmail@web30113.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004001c6b347$eb0c4e60$2930cece@charlie> perhaps this might be a more reliable source: http://www.wisdom-books.com/ProductDetail.asp?CatNumber=5686 joanna ============= Hi, "Our cycle is a happy one, three leaders have already lived . . . The Buddha supreme am I, but after me, Metteyya comes. While still this happy cycle lasts, before its tale of years shall lapse. This Buddha, called Metteyya, shall be supreme chief of all Men." [Henry C. Warren, Buddhism in translation, p.481-82] If I read correctly, it is a translation from the Anagatavamsa. However, I couldn't find the passage here: http://www.ubakhin.com/uchittin/arimet/ARIMET09.html Anyone know the source of the passage? Thanks, Rahula ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Groups are talking. We?re listening. Check out the handy changes to Yahoo! Groups. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ buddha-l mailing list buddha-l@mailman.swcp.com http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/listinfo/buddha-l ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/402 - Release Date: 7/27/2006 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060729/df05def6/attachment.htm From rahula_80 at yahoo.com Sat Jul 29 19:05:26 2006 From: rahula_80 at yahoo.com (Ngawang Dorje) Date: Sat Jul 29 19:05:30 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Metteyya In-Reply-To: <004001c6b347$eb0c4e60$2930cece@charlie> Message-ID: <20060730010526.23164.qmail@web30102.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi, "And Ananda, holding back his tears, said to the Buddha: 'Who will teach us when you are gone?' And the Blessed One answered: 'I am not the first Buddha who has come upon the Earth, nor shall I be the last. In the right time, another Buddha will arise in the world, a Holy One, a Supremely Enlightened One, endowed with wisdom in conduct, auspicious, Knowing the Truth, an incomparable leader of men, a Master of Spirit and mortals. He will reveal to you these Eternal Truths. He will preach his Dharma, Glorious in its Origin, Glorious in the Middle, and Glorious in its end, in the Spirit as well as the letter. He will proclaim a life of Dharma, wholly Perfect and Pure, even as I now proclaim.' Ananda said: 'How shall we know him?' And the Buddha said: 'He will be known as Maitreya which means, the friend.'" I have read that this dialogue was Paul Carus' invention. However, the reference for this dialogue was given Mahaparinirvana Sutra Chapter V, Verses 1-14. However, I could not find it mentioned in Chapter 5 of Kosho Yamamoto's english translation of the Mahaparinirvana Sutra? Have I misserd out or have I been looking in the wrong place? Or perhaps the text indeed is an invention of Carus? Thanks, Rahula --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail Beta. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060729/e8f8cbbe/attachment.html From rahula_80 at yahoo.com Sun Jul 30 10:25:08 2006 From: rahula_80 at yahoo.com (Ngawang Dorje) Date: Sun Jul 30 10:25:11 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Ever-smiling In-Reply-To: <20060730010526.23164.qmail@web30102.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20060730162508.13743.qmail@web30104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Hi, According to Walpola Rahula, the Buddha is ever-smiling (mihita-pubbamgama).[pg 27, What the Buddha taught] Unfortunately, he did not give the source for this. Can anyone help me with it? Thanks, Rahula --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs.Try it free. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailman.swcp.com/mailman/private/buddha-l/attachments/20060730/f521cf3d/attachment.htm From selwyn at ntlworld.com Sun Jul 30 11:20:34 2006 From: selwyn at ntlworld.com (L.S. Cousins) Date: Sun Jul 30 11:39:06 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] Ever-smiling In-Reply-To: <20060730162508.13743.qmail@web30104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20060730162508.13743.qmail@web30104.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Rahula, It is probably Cp-a 287 i.e. the commentary to the Cariyaapi.taka. See Bhikkhu Bodhi, _The All-embracing Net of Views_, p. 268 for a translation of this part. Lance Cousins >Hi, > >According to Walpola Rahula, the Buddha is ever-smiling >(mihita-pubbamgama).[pg 27, What the Buddha taught] > >Unfortunately, he did not give the source for this. > >Can anyone help me with it? From mahaabaala at hotmail.com Mon Jul 31 14:28:38 2006 From: mahaabaala at hotmail.com (Michael Attwood) Date: Mon Jul 31 14:28:46 2006 Subject: [Buddha-l] (no subject) Message-ID: Alex Wilding alex at chagchen.org Fri Jul 28 00:55:28 MDT 2006 wrote: >I infer, from your implication that the existence of the criteria that I >had in mind is both novel and pleasing, that you are being sarcastic, so >I'll move on from there. >You can call it a mantra if you like, of course. Its structure and usage, >however, remain at least a little atypical in the context I mention. Not sarcasm - more like heavy scepticism, apologies if I layed it on too thick. Actually I am interested in what criteria you might apply. I once read in Buddha-L for instance that o.m aa.h huu.m is not a mantra. Why? What is it about the structure and usage that make you think it is not a mantra under the conditions that you specify. I'd be even more interested in some authorative source on this. Most mantra research seems to only cover the Vedic mantras (Fritz Staal and co), or is Japanese (Kukai). Tibetan's seem to have very little to say about what they consider mantra to be, and focus on how to use them. >Prior to the discussion here in recent days I had only come across >citations of the verse as Sanskrit. Well I think the Pali biographical material is generally considered to be earlier than the Sanskrit. In works like the Lalitavistara the story is very much elaborated and embroidered. Similarly for the Buddhacarita. Regards Jayarava _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live™ Messenger has arrived. Click here to download it for free! http://imagine-msn.com/messenger/launch80/?locale=en-gb