[Buddha-l] Abhidharma vindicated once again

Zelders.YH zelders.yh at wxs.nl
Wed Mar 9 17:59:08 MST 2011

Dan wrote :
> Herman, my friend, arguing with/against me won't create facts on the ground.
Dannyboy, that's not my game at all.
> The "after" death issue: This is the way most sources, including the clip
> from HHDL, speak of it.
HH may have learned the currently dominant medical definition for 
clinical death from his Mind and Life friends. By that definition those 
in tukdam are dead. So I suppose that when HH comes to speak of it to a 
western audience he will mention that as a fact. But did Tibetans 
traditionally view tukdam as a post-mortem occurrence, I wonder ? Don't 
you know some tibetologists we could ask ?
You claim that "most sources" speak of tukdam as an after-death 
happening. I don't think that you would be able to corroborate that claim.
> I called it a liminal space between life and death.
'Liminal', now there's a useful term, for the time being.

>> Or take this sentence from the description of Chogye Trichen Rinpoche's
>> tukdam :  "The high lamas commented that
> Second hand hearsay won't cut it. What would you EXPECT them to say?
I'm not as credulous as you apparently take me to be. You also know 
quite well that that's not the reason why I quoted that sentence from 
Chogye Trichen's tukdam story. You had stated that there was no mention 
of body heat in that story, and my citation was meant to prove you 
wrong. Not a thing to be happy about. I wish we could keep things kosher.

Herman Zelders

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